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Jeremy87Thursday 09th of December 2004 05:34:20 AM
dative case - Well, I understand some things about the dative. The thing that kinda confuses me is that in Romanian, the dative sometimes have possessive properties. Can someone explain to me (heh there's the dative there) when you use the dative for possessive in romanian?
Luludya738Sunday 12th of December 2004 03:11:19 AM
- Where did you hear that the Dative can show posession? It is true...but this are matters for upper-intermediate level.
There is a particular case in which at the Reflexive Voice (we have Active, Pasive and Reflexive) there is a case in which the reflexive pronoun is in Dative posessive.
This is the case of sentences like: "Eu imi spal pantalonii" (I'm washing my pants).
And it is called the Dative-posessive coz the form "imi" may be doubled by a possesive pronoun (which becomes adjective) like "mei" (my,mine).
So you can also say "Eu imi spal pantalonii (mei)" even if "mei" may as well lack. Other examples: "Ea isi plimba sora (sa)" (She takes her dog for a walk) "Noi ne mancam prajitura (noastra)" (We are eating our cake). When it can't be doubled (coz it doesn't have sense) it means it is just dative, and not dative posessive. "Ea isi aminteste o poveste". You cannot say "Ea isi aminteste o poveste sa" It doesn't have sense. And here's a tip: usually when after a reflexive verb follows a (definite)articled noun, we are talking abt a Dative posessive pronoun. When the noun is articled with an indefinite article, it is not the case anymore. It is a bit difficult to explain coz i don't know what's your level of Romanian. This is why I asked you in the begining. Maybe you meant to say smth else and you didn't express yourself to well. Anyway..there are Romanians who don't know about this, so don't worry. ;) The Dative posessive is very frequently used but most of the Romanians don't even know it is called like that. If I didn;t manage to clear thing up for you, let me know where should I be more explicit.

Bye :)
rbrumaMonday 13th of December 2004 08:03:59 PM
Dog's sister - Very impressive description of the possesive aspects of Dative, however for all non-Romanian speakers out there please do not try to translate "Ea şi plimbă sora (sa)" with "She takes her dog for a walk" or huge misunderstandings or even breaks of friendship might well arise.

Errare humanum est :)

Razvan
AlexWednesday 15th of December 2004 12:16:36 AM
Indeed. - Thanks very much, Luludya, for a comprehensive description.

And, just so you know, you can edit a post to correct errors. Just look for the edit button.

:)

Alex.
Luludya738Thursday 16th of December 2004 07:21:15 PM
OHHHH MY GOOODDD.... :) - You cannot imagine how much did I laugh at seing what I had writen :) The truth is that at first I wrote the example with the dog in Romanian and then... as I don't have Romanian fonts coz I usually write from a netcafe, I thought to use words which don't require specific fonts, as "caine" does...so I changed it with "sora" but I forgot to change the translation too... hehehehe... It was very funny of me...and the funniest thing is that even after I read your reply...I stil didn't understand what were you trying to tell me... It was only after a close look at what I had previously writen that I understood what you meant... I can be such a loonatic sometimes... (to be read: "all the times")

Bye and thanx for your observation ;)
Jeremy87Saturday 01st of January 2005 07:56:41 AM
- Mulţumesc foarte mult luludya :). Well, my level of Romanian.. umm.. not sure lol, i guess I'm an intermediate, not fluent yet, but Alex is being very helpful to me getting there :). Sometimes, i get a little confused on the dative possessive, and I know sometimes you have to say it in that context and can't really use "meu, tau" etc. like ti-ai luat medicamentele? did you take your medication? You can't say "ai luat medicamentele tale". Correct me if I'm wrong :). Thanks again for your help.

-Jeremy