Urdu Syntax--a Question From A True Urdu Neophyte Help With Urdu Syntax

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kisaamin Saturday 10th of March 2007 02:50:14 AM
Syntax--a question from a true Urdu Neophyte - Salaam to all you helpful souls!

I know this is supposed to be a phrase-based learning method, but I find it very difficult to learn without some building blocks. So I\'m hoping somebody can help me by posting the Urdu versions of these basic English sentence formations. It\'s hard for me to learn by memorization. I would much rather know *how* a sentence is formed and then learn supplemental vocabulary.

For example:

The most basic English sentence formation is

Subject + Verb: I eat

then

Subject + Verb + Object: I eat apples

I believe that things begin to look different starting with the second formation when speaking Urdu, so that the sentence would be formed like

Subject + Object + Verb

Is this always the rule, or is it conditional? If somebody could please respond to this, I will be HAPPY to post some more complex questions on the same subject (word order). :)

Shukria!!!

~Kisa

Wordmaster Saturday 10th of March 2007 03:36:02 AM
- Wasalam. :D

Don\'t worry bout the name. Ask about anything, we\'re all here to help. :D

The order of a sentence in urdu... doesnt really matter. :P Well, almost all different orders in which the subject, object and verb are combined are correct. The meaning changes slightly with different orders. Normally, the word spoken first in the order carries a greater meaning in the context.

Examples: Words used = Khana/Khata (to eat), Hona/Hu (to be), Seyb (Apple) and Mein (I). Mein (I) is the subject, khata and hu the verbs, and Seyb the object.

To truly understand the difference between the following examples, imagine they are answers to the questions in the brackets. That weill illustrate that the answer to the question is usually the first word in the order, showing how it carries greater meaning as it is the answer.

[b]Correct Conjugations[/b](Listed in decreasing order of natural speech, ie, the lowest ones sound wierdest when spoken, but are still correct)

Mein Seyb Khata Hu. (S O V)
{Answers \"What do [b]you[/b] eat?\")
Mein Khata Hu Seyb. (S V O)
(Answers \"[b]Who[/b] eats apples?\")
Seyb Mein Khata Hu. (O S V)
(Answers \"Who eats [b]apples[/b]?\")
Seyb Khata Hu Mein. (O V S)
{Answers \"[b]What[/b] do you eat?\")
Khata Hu Mein Seyb. (V S O)
(This is one is not very common, it signifies a sort of confession sort of manner, as if someone was confessing to eating apples)
Khata Hu Seyb Mein. (V O S)
(This is also uncommon and is sort of poetic. This almost borders on being incorrect.)

Therefore, the most natural speaking method is S O V. The most unnatural ones are V S O and V O S. I suggest you stick with S O V as it is the one that is most natural to speakers.

Incase you\'re wondering, Khata hu, althought two words, are treated together as one verb. That is beacuse this is the way that the present tense is spoken in urdu. For more on verbs, refer to my (soon to be written) thread on urdu verbs.

Hope that clears up things about formation. :D :D

kisaamin Sunday 11th of March 2007 02:18:33 AM
- Thank you Wordmaster!

May I try another?

Could you please do the same with prepositional phrases and syntax?

In English:

S + O + PP is the most typical and basic

i.e. I eat at the table

Where do PP come in the sentence in Urdu? (again, most typical and basic, though your alternate examples really help)

Shukria

Phrasebase Archive
	kisaamin	Saturday 10th of March 2007 02:50:14 AM
	Syntax--a question from a true Urdu Neophyte - Salaam to all you helpful souls! I know this is supposed to be a phrase-based learning method, but I find it very difficult to learn without some building blocks. So I\'m hoping somebody can help me by posting the Urdu versions of these basic English sentence formations. It\'s hard for me to learn by memorization. I would much rather know how a sentence is formed and then learn supplemental vocabulary. For example: The most basic English sentence formation is Subject + Verb: I eat then Subject + Verb + Object: I eat apples I believe that things begin to look different starting with the second formation when speaking Urdu, so that the sentence would be formed like Subject + Object + Verb Is this always the rule, or is it conditional? If somebody could please respond to this, I will be HAPPY to post some more complex questions on the same subject (word order). :) Shukria!!! ~Kisa
	Wordmaster	Saturday 10th of March 2007 03:36:02 AM
	- Wasalam. :D Don\'t worry bout the name. Ask about anything, we\'re all here to help. :D The order of a sentence in urdu... doesnt really matter. :P Well, almost all different orders in which the subject, object and verb are combined are correct. The meaning changes slightly with different orders. Normally, the word spoken first in the order carries a greater meaning in the context. Examples: Words used = Khana/Khata (to eat), Hona/Hu (to be), Seyb (Apple) and Mein (I). Mein (I) is the subject, khata and hu the verbs, and Seyb the object. To truly understand the difference between the following examples, imagine they are answers to the questions in the brackets. That weill illustrate that the answer to the question is usually the first word in the order, showing how it carries greater meaning as it is the answer. [b]Correct Conjugations[/b](Listed in decreasing order of natural speech, ie, the lowest ones sound wierdest when spoken, but are still correct) Mein Seyb Khata Hu. (S O V) {Answers \"What do [b]you[/b] eat?\") Mein Khata Hu Seyb. (S V O) (Answers \"[b]Who[/b] eats apples?\") Seyb Mein Khata Hu. (O S V) (Answers \"Who eats [b]apples[/b]?\") Seyb Khata Hu Mein. (O V S) {Answers \"[b]What[/b] do you eat?\") Khata Hu Mein Seyb. (V S O) (This is one is not very common, it signifies a sort of confession sort of manner, as if someone was confessing to eating apples) Khata Hu Seyb Mein. (V O S) (This is also uncommon and is sort of poetic. This almost borders on being incorrect.) Therefore, the most natural speaking method is S O V. The most unnatural ones are V S O and V O S. I suggest you stick with S O V as it is the one that is most natural to speakers. Incase you\'re wondering, Khata hu, althought two words, are treated together as one verb. That is beacuse this is the way that the present tense is spoken in urdu. For more on verbs, refer to my (soon to be written) thread on urdu verbs. Hope that clears up things about formation. :D :D
	kisaamin	Sunday 11th of March 2007 02:18:33 AM
	- Thank you Wordmaster! May I try another? Could you please do the same with prepositional phrases and syntax? In English: S + O + PP is the most typical and basic i.e. I eat at the table Where do PP come in the sentence in Urdu? (again, most typical and basic, though your alternate examples really help) Shukria